S/PV.8041 Security Council

In accordance with rule 37 of the Council’s provisional rules of procedure, I invite the representative of Colombia to participate in this meeting. In accordance with rule 39 of the Council’s provisional rules of procedure, I invite Mr. Jean Arnault, Special Representative of the Secretary-General and Head of the United Nations Mission in Colombia, to participate in this meeting. The Security Council will now begin its consideration of the item on its agenda. I wish to draw the attention of Council members to document S/2017/745, which contains the report of the Secretary-General on the United Nations Verification Mission in Colombia. I now give the floor to Mr. Arnault. Mr. Arnault: I am grateful for the opportunity to brief the Council on the implementation of its resolution 2366 (2017), of 10 July 2017, in which it which decided to establish, at the request of the Government of Colombia and the Revolutionary Armed Forces of Colombia-People’s Army (FARC-EP), the United Nations Verification Mission in Colombia, to begin its activities in two weeks, on 26 September. But prior to doing so, let me underline what is, politically speaking, the culmination of the ceasefire, cessation-of-hostilities and weapons laydown process that has unfolded since the signing of the Final Peace Agreement on 24 November of last year, namely, the formal transformation, after 53 years of armed conflict, of the former Revolutionary Armed Forces of Colombia-People’s Army into a political party, whose founding congress took place in Bogotá two weeks ago. The Congress, which elected the party’s new leadership and executive secretariat and adopted its political platform, took place exactly one year after the declaration of the bilateral and definitive ceasefire, on 29 August 2016. This gives us a measure of the momentous developments that have taken place in the past 12 months and of the intense political will that was required from both sides to drive this process forward. The resolution requested that the current mission should begin provisional verification activities anticipated by the Verification Mission, and the Council will soon receive, together with the Mission’s last report, our initial verification of the FARC’s reintegration and the implementation of security guarantees in the areas hardest hit by the armed conflict. The Council also requested that we initiate preparations now, including on the ground, to ensure the smoothest possible transition to the Verification Mission. Allow me therefore to supplement the Secretary-General’s report (S/2017/745) on the size, operational aspects and mandate of the new mission with a summary of the measures taken since 10 July to fulfil the Council’s request. These include the establishment at all levels — local, regional and national — of transitional teams with civilian personnel and observers, who have begun verification related to the new Mission’s mandate; the identification of staffing needs for the next Mission and the advertisement of priority positions pending approval of the Secretary-General’s report by the Security Council, and the decisions of the General Assembly; and the careful selection of observers from the current Mission who would be retained for the upcoming mission so as to ensure adequate representation of current contributing countries. In doing so, we have placed special emphasis on retaining women observers with both military and police background. This will ensure an unprecedented percentage of women among the observers of the Verification Mission. A deployment plan has also been finalized that ensures an appropriate skill set, geographical distribution and gender balance at the local, regional and national levels. Reconnaissance visits have taken place to all prospective team sites and sub-offices, in particular with a view to identifying possible areas of collocation with the United Nations country team. Potential logistics contractors have been contacted in connection with the new Mission’s transport and accommodation needs. In addition, a request was made to United Nations Headquarters for a series of exemptions and measures to facilitate the smooth transition between the two Missions. Finally, in response to the Council’s call for coordination with the United Nations system, we have already put in place the joint working groups on reintegration and security guarantees between the Mission and the United Nations country team to ensure full consistency between the implementation and the verification sides of the United Nations in Colombia. In summary, although the time frame was tight, the sum total of these efforts carried out under the Council’s authority have put us on track to start the Verification Mission on time. It will be in a position to fulfil its mandate on day one. One pending issue is the settlement of accounts deriving from the cost-sharing arrangements between the United Nations and the Government of Colombia related to the operation of the tripartite Monitoring and Verification Mechanism. In cooperation with the Colombian Government, United Nations Headquarters and the Mission are working hard towards resolving outstanding issues before the completion of our Mission’s mandate. As the Council is aware, last week, on 4 September, the Government of Colombia and the National Liberation Army reached agreement on a temporary ceasefire that would start on 1 October and end on 12 January 2018. The ceasefire should be accompanied by a series of measures aimed at improving the humanitarian situation of communities in the conflict areas. The agreement provides that the United Nations would assist with the verification of the commitments made. I met with both heads of delegations who have confirmed their interest in the United Nations involvement and members of the Mission have already engaged with the technical commitmentission on the ceasefire. Further discussions starting this week will hopefully enable the Secretary-General to make recommendations to the Council in the very near future. In the past few days, before millions of Colombians assembled in several cities, Pope Francis delivered a very strong message in favour of reconciliation, forgiveness and confidence in the future to a society that bears the scars of decades of conflict and struggles to imagine a Colombia free from ubiquitous, relentless violence. Thankfully, over the past months the peace process between the Government and FARC-EP has slowly but steadily tipped the scales in favour of hope. We trust that the presence of the United Nations, the work of the United Nations system and the support of the Security Council can and should shore up further the confidence of Colombian society in the stable peace to which its citizens so ardently aspire.

I thank Mr. Arnault for his briefing. I now give the floor to those Council members who wish to make statements.

I thank Special Representative Jean Arnault for his comprehensive briefing this morning and for the work he does on the ground in Colombia. He can remain absolutely certain of Sweden’s continued strong support for his efforts, for the United Nations Mission in Colombia and for the second Mission, as described in the Secretary-General’s report (S/2017/745). We commend the strong commitment to peace of both parties in Colombia and their efforts to overcome challenges to the implementation of the Final Peace Agreement. A sustained effort is now needed from the State at the central, regional and local levels, as well as the United Nations system and the international community, in support of the Agreement. This must include comprehensive rural reform, so that all Colombians can share in the tangible dividends of peace. The political, economic and social reincorporation of former combatants into society is an integral part of that process. Violence against human rights defenders and community leaders demonstrates the urgent need for the second United Nations Mission to also verify the implementation of personal and collective security guarantees, as requested by the parties. We welcome the focus on the second Mission having a strong presence locally and regionally, which must be robust enough to allow proper verification of security and reintegration. We also welcome the strong emphasis on coordination and cooperation with the United Nations country team, as we just heard. We would also like to thank the Special Representative of the Secretary-General for the work that the Mission has undertaken regarding the inclusion and participation of women, which, as the report points out, has been an important contributing factor for the success of the Mission so far. Sweden is pleased to be able to contribute to the current United Nations Mission and it stands ready to continue to support the succeeding Mission with personnel. We welcome the recently announced ceasefire between the Government of Colombia and the National Liberation Army. The fact that the parties have indicated an interest in having the United Nations verify the implementation of the ceasefire is testimony to the success of the current Verification Mission. The United Nations and the Security Council must now stand prepared to assist the parties moving forward. We note the commitment by National Liberation Army to cease the recruitment of minors. As Chair of the Working Group on Children and Armed Conflict, we would like to highlight the Working Group’s conclusions on Colombia from February this year which, inter alia, encouraged the parties to ensure that child protection is given due consideration as early as possible in the peace process and that it is a core priority. Peace in Colombia is now taking root. As the people of Colombia and their leaders continue to consolidate the gains made, we must all continue to stand by their side. Sweden is committed to doing so.

I would like to thank Mr. Jean Arnault, Special Representative of the Secretary- General, for his encouraging briefing and his good work on the ground We will soon witness the successful completion of the first United Nations Mission in Colombia and the laying down of arms process. We congratulate the Colombian people for taking this historic step. Japan is very pleased by the mutual confidence and good faith demonstrated between the Government and the Fuerzas Armadas Revolucionarias de Colombia (FARC) during this process. We commend Special Representative of the Secretary-General Arnault and his team, international observers and civilian staff for their excellent work in close coordination with the parties. The Council’s decision to respond to the Colombian-initiated request by establishing the United Nations Mission was the right one. We take note of the Secretary-General’s recommendations on the United Nations Verification Mission, based on consultations with the stakeholders. Japan is ready to constructively discuss a draft resolution. We note the importance of continued close coordination between the Mission and the United Nations country team and the seamless transition of the Missions. The whole-of-United Nations approach will remain critical. Ultimately, long-term success depends on the determination and commitment demonstrated by the parties. We look forward to their continued efforts during the second Mission’s deployment. The social and economic reintegration process is a delicate and challenging part of the peace process. To guarantee genuine peace, FARC members who have laid down arms must be able to fully participate in economic and social life in Colombia as soon as possible. Sufficient resources and security guarantees are essential. FARC must also observe the Peace Agreement and make efforts to fully reintegrate into society. We take note of the establishment of several legal mechanisms at the national level for reintegration, as well as for security. It is vital that they function effectively and coherently on the ground, including after the elections. Strong coordination efforts by the Government are important to achieve maximum results. Another piece of positive news is the temporary ceasefire announcement between the Government and the National Liberation Army on 4 September. We welcome the ceasefire and strongly hope that it will lead to productive peace negotiations between the parties as well as bolster the current peace process, in general. We appreciate the efforts made by the guarantors, Brazil, Chile, Cuba, Ecuador, Norway and Venezuela, as well as the Catholic Church. We look forward to their continued support for the peace negotiations. In conclusion, Japan reiterates its support for the parties in implementing the Peace Agreement, and once again commends the United Nations Mission in Colombia for its vital work. Japan will continue to support the people of Colombia through the efforts of the second mission.

I am grateful to the Secretary-General for his report of 30 August (S/2017/745) and to Special Representative Jean Arnault for the briefing he just delivered. Moreover, we commend him on the efficient work that he has carried out at the head of the United Nations Mission in Colombia. The important announcement of the Final Peace Agreement between the Government of Colombia and the Fuerzas Armadas Revolucionarias de Colombia — Ejercito del Pueblo (FARC-EP) on the Bilateral and Definitive Ceasefire and the Cessation of Hostilities and the Laying down of Arms for 102 days is generating hope that peace in Colombia, in addition to being stable and lasting, will be comprehensive. Following the adoption of resolution 2366 (2017) on 10 July, establishing the United Nations Verification Mission in Colombia and the culmination on 15 August of the extraction of all weapons and the destruction of all existing munitions in the 26 camps of the FARC-EP, we have received encouraging news that underscores steady progress in the consolidation of the peace process in Colombia. It is extremely important that the United Nations now give its full support so as to ensure a successful political, economic and social integration of the members of FARC-EP, and to implement measures ensuring their security. Without doubt, the report of the Secretary-General once again reflects the commitment of the United Nations to the peace process in Colombia, and shows his receptiveness to the requests of the parties and their readiness to take up without delay the verification mandate with which it has been entrusted. It is important to highlight that the report underlines that its recommendations are the result of consultations held with the Government of Colombia and the FARC-EP. That is a key point because we must not forget that the process must always be guided by the main stakeholders. The detailed information provided with regard to the mandates, size, structure and operational aspects of the new Mission demonstrates the organization and seriousness of the task that the United Nations is carrying out, with the work that has already been carried out by the current Mission and in cooperation and continuous coordination with the United Nations country team in Colombia, as well as the Government of Colombia and FARC-EP. We must now move towards implementing all points of the Final Peace Agreement and enhance our efforts to avoid delays and maximize interinstitutional coordination so as to prevent any weakening of confidence between the parties in the process, based on respect for mutual obligations. We welcome the series of mechanisms and measures that have already been implemented for the reintegration of FARC-EP, and to ensure that security measures are implemented, which will benefit from the experience of the United Nations system in thematic areas, such as gender issues, child protection, human rights and ethnic and indigenous issues. It is also important to know that the Mission will be deployed with a view to ensuring its presence in the rural areas most affected by the conflict, which are also those in which the reintegration of the members of FARC-EP is taking place. The commitments that have been assumed, upheld and championed by the parties, the measures and mechanisms that are already under way to ensure the implementation of those commitments, and the important role played by the United Nations Verification Mission are elements that together reaffirm our confidence in the establishment of stable and lasting peace in Colombia, which we is now on the verge of completion. Uruguay therefore call on everyone to spare no effort to provide every form of assistance that the stakeholders in the peace process have requested of the Organization. As we have on previous occasions, we reaffirm our support for the peace process in Colombia and for the main stakeholders, in the hope of seeeing the National Liberation Army become one of the leading actors in that process.

I would like to thank Special Representative of the Secretary-General and Head of the United Nations Mission in Colombia Jean Arnault for his comprehensive briefing and commend his and the United Nations Mission’s contribution to the successful completion of the first stage of the Final Peace Agreement. Kazakhstan welcomes all positive recent developments and major milestones and achievements that occurred in fulfilling the peace process in Colombia. The transition of the Fuerzas Armadas Revolucionarias de Colombia (FARC) from a rebel group to a political party with a new leadership and new logo is a promising sign to ending the decades-long conflict. The finalization of the extraction of FARC weapons has nearly completed the last stage in the process of laying down arms. We welcome the extension of the mandate of the current United Nations Mission for an additional two weeks to conduct operations verifying the destruction of arms caches until the Government of Colombia takes over that task on 15 September. Kazakhstan commends the recent announcement of the ceasefire and cessation of hostilities between the Government of Colombia and the National Liberation Army. We believe that that will result in a longer-term and more firm ceasefire leading to a lasting settlement in Colombia. We hope that following the historic bilateral ceasefire, the National Liberation Army will cease its acts of kidnapping, attacks on oil pipelines and atrocities committed against the civilian population, while the Government of Columbia will do its best to improve living conditions for the civilian population in conflict areas and ensure the security of activist leaders and citizens. We join the Secretary-General in commending the role of the guarantors, Brazil, Chile, Cuba, Ecuador, Norway and Venezuela, as well as the Catholic Church in supporting the much needed negotiations. We believe that it is very important to ensure the successful implementation of certain provisions of the Final Peace Agreement, such as the political, economic and social reintegration of former FARC rebels, personal and collective security guarantees and comprehensive programmes on security protection measures for communities and organizations in conflict-affected areas. We therefore emphasize the need for both parties to continue to fulfil their obligations and commitments under the provisions of the Final Agreement. We are of the view that the United Nations Verification Mission will ensure the full implementation of the peace accords and secure the irreversibility of the peace process. It is worth noting that the Verification Mission has taken into account all of the shortcomings and drawbacks encountered during the implementation of the first mandate so as to ensure the success and efficiency of the second mission. We agree that recruiting a larger number of women for the implementation of the peace process and further deepening collaboration with the United Nations country team to ensure a whole-of-United Nations approach in Colombia are crucial for the efficiency of the Verification Mechanism. We fully endorse the Secretary-General’s recommendations with regard to the effective deployment of the second mission in Colombia in terms of geographical representation, staffing and the mandate’s structure. Kazakhstan extended its full support for the mandate of the second mission when it co-sponsored resolution 2366 (2017) reiterating its commitment to support the parties in implementing the historic Final Peace Agreement (see S/PV.7997). Lastly, we realize that the Colombian peace process is not only a guarantee of security and stability in the western hemisphere, it is also a positive example to countries around the world facing similar challenges in the form of long, protracted conflicts. The fact that the Government and the FARC approached the United Nations about helping them to verify the Peace Agreements’ accomplishments makes us confident that the parties are united in their desire to bring a brighter future to Colombia and its people. Kazakhstan would therefore like to congratulate the Government of Colombia on its success in bringing peace and stability to the country and to express its strong support for the parties involved. We stand ready to join the multilateral and regional efforts to accelerate the momentum of a peace process that will ultimately result in stability, progress and prosperity for all Colombians.

We would like thank Mr. Jean Arnault, Special Representative of the Secretary- General and Head of the United Nations Mission in Colombia, for sharing with the Security Council the Secretary-General’s report on the United Nations Verification Mission in Colombia (S/2017/745). In the past few months, the Security Council, and the international community as a whole, have seen the peace process in Colombia make extraordinary progress. The ceasefire has been consolidated, culminating in the laying down of arms by the Fuerzas Armadas Revolucionarias de Colombia-Ejército del Pueblo (FARC-EP), followed this week by the destruction of weapons caches. We note that both sides have taken visible steps towards fulfilling the Final Agreement for Ending the Conflict and Building a Stable and Lasting Peace and have shown that they are determined to stay the course, which gives us hope that this long-desired peace can be achieved. We would like to once again commend the Government and the leaders of the FARC for the political leadership they have shown in achieving this goal, and we should not neglect to mention the third corner of this virtuous triangle, that is, the active participation of the victims of the armed conflict. That leadership, along with a bold approach and a spirit of reconciliation, has made this an exemplary process for the whole world. We would also like to thank and pay tribute to the United Nations Mission in Colombia, including the Special Representative of the Secretary-General and his entire team, for what they have achieved in a short space of time. There can be no question that the tripartite Monitoring and Verification Mechanism has been fundamental to maintaining and strengthening confidence between the Government and the FARC-EP and could definitely be a model for conflict resolution in other parts of the world. The men and women who have served as observers in the Mechanism since its launch in 2016 have done an impeccable job, for which we would also like to pay them a sincere tribute — and, if I may, I would like to single out the more than 50 Bolivian soldiers who participated in the first mission. However, we should not forget that there is still much work to be done in response to one of the main focuses of the Peace Agreement — transforming the standard of living of the most vulnerable sectors affected by the conflict and reducing the gap between rural and urban areas. We welcome the efforts that the Government is making in that regard by deploying security forces, establishing the rule of law, promoting the provision of goods and services to the affected areas and creating a special new jurisdiction for peace. We also believe that it will be very important to address the issues of formalizing titles to land in rural areas and improving social security coverage for farmers and peasants. We hope that the international community can provide the necessary cooperation. As we know, the United Nations Verification Mission in Colombia — the country’s second Mission — will be responsible for verifying the political, economic and social reintegration of the FARC’s more than 10,000 members, as well as the implementation of measures for their safety and security, in accordance with paragraphs 3.2, 3.4 and 6.3 of the Final Agreement, which is unquestionably a complicated part of the process. Bolivia believes that the achievement of sustainable and lasting peace in Colombia depends upon successfully reintegrating the FARC-EP into civilian life. We believe that both the Colombian Government and the FARC will continue to demonstrate political leadership and firm resolve to comply with the agreements and bring peace to their country. For that, it will be essential to ensure that the Security Council is united in support of the Colombian process. In that regard, we have welcomed the Secretary-General’s efforts and taken note of the recommendations made for the second Mission. The Council will meet in the next few days to discuss the information in the report, and I am sure that we will continue to work in the same spirit of unity. Bolivia would like to take this opportunity to welcome the new political party formed by the FARC-EP, which represents a historic step for them as they now legally enter political life. As President Evo Morales Ayma said when we welcomed its founding congress, we support peace, social justice and sovereignty for Colombia. Today, our revolutions are democratic, achieved with votes, not weapons. We also welcome the agreement reached between the Colombian Government and the Ejército de Liberación Nacional on implementing a temporary bilateral ceasefire, recently announced at the Quito public peace dialogue table. In conclusion, I would to recall the message of reconciliation that Pope Francis dedicated to the young people of Colombia during his recent visit there, when he said that they can help to be “the promise of a new beginning for Colombia that leaves behind the floods of discord and violence, a Colombia that wants to bear abundant fruits of justice and peace”.

Today is one of those rare occasions when a delay by the Security Council in adopting a draft resolution is the result of positive developments in events. We welcome the signing in Quito, on 4 September, of the agreement on a temporary ceasefire between the Government of Colombia and the Ejército de Liberación Nacional. We appreciate the support of Brazil, Chile, Cuba, Ecuador, Norway and Venezuela, the guarantor countries for the peace process. Thanks to their services as mediators, this important agreement has become a reality and, in our view, is an important step towards a permanent ceasefire. We hope that, in conjunction with the successful conduct of the reconciliation process with the Fuerzas Armadas Revolucionarias de Colombia (FARC), it will bring us closer to a final settlement of this decades-long internal conflict and the attainment of civil peace in the country. We thank Mr. Jean Arnault, Head of the United Nations Mission in Colombia, for his briefing, and consider his recommendations to be a helpful basis for informed discussions on the so-called second special political Mission, the United Nations Verification Mission in Colombia, which will start work as early as 26 September. We welcome the successful progress in the peace process, particularly the completion of the surrender of weapons and the demobilization of insurgents under United Nations supervision, which has paved the way for transforming the FARC into a political force. We hope that the parties will carry out their remaining tasks in good faith and a timely manner, including destroying arms caches and taking steps to achieve the former combatants’ socioeconomic and political reintegration. We expect the Verification Mission to provide the necessary assistance for that. However, it will be important to keep a close eye on the security situation to ensure that no power vacuums arise. For our part, we affirm our readiness to continue to fully support the intra-Colombian peace process and the people and the Government of Colombia as they work to build a durable peace and development post-conflict.

I now give the floor to the representative of Colombia.

I would like to thank you, Mr. President, for convening today’s meeting, and in particular Mr. Jean Arnault, Special Representative of the Secretary-General, and his entire team, for their report (S/2017/745). On behalf of President Juan Manuel Santos Calderón, we would like to express our appreciation to the Secretary-General and the Security Council for the effectiveness of the work of the United Nations Mission in Colombia, the first special political Mission in our country, which will come to a successful end on 25 September. A long time before we signed the Final Agreement for Ending the Conflict and Building a Stable and Lasting Peace, they made a bold bet on peace in Colombia. That demonstration of confidence gave our peace process a major impetus that not only resulted in that Final Agreement but also enabled us to move decisively towards implementing the agreements on reintegrating the Fuerzas Armadas Revolucionarias de Colombia-Ejército del Pueblo (FARC-EP) into civil, economic, social and political life and achieving security guarantees. In the light of the provisions of resolution 2366 (2017), the Government of Colombia acknowledges that the Mission is a United Nations mission, in all respects, whose sole mandate is to verify that both the Colombian State and the FARC-EP comply fully with the commitments in items 3.2 and 3.4 of the Agreement. The report (S/2017/745) presented by the Special Representative acknowledges the progress made by the Government in implementing the Peace Agreement. I would now like to address some of the points that we believe to be of greatest importance. To ensure coordination among all national entities responsible for implementing the Agreement and for decision-making at the highest level, a post-conflict cabinet was established, led by the President himself, who then appointed Vice-President Óscar Naranjo as the interlocutor for the United Nations Verification Mission in Colombia. Eighty-seven pieces of legislation have been adopted, including five amendments to the political Constitution, so as to provide a solid legal structure to what was agreed upon and to form the basis for the political reform that allowed the FARC-EP to be registered as a political organization. On 16 August, the so-called territorial areas for training and reincorporation were established, where activities are carried out to facilitate the initial phases of returning the members of the FARC to civilian life and to make a positive contribution to the surrounding communities. The national council for reintegration has held 44 meetings to lay the groundwork for planned projects and decision-making among the parties. Through decisions taken by council for reintegration, three censuses were carried out in order to clearly identify former combatants. The socioeconomic census covered 10,015 people and will provide the information required to facilitate and structure the long-term process of reintegrating members of the FARC into civilian life. The educational census will allow us to start the process to help many of them to become literate, through the implementation of flexible educational models in the former 26 zones. In all, 4,500 former members of the FARC-EP and 4,000 people in surrounding communities are taking part. The health census will serve as the basis for the development of a short- and medium-term strategy to meet needs in that area. An institutional resource matrix was also established, which will allow for overall well- being and provide psychosocial support, pensions, academic training, labour force and productivity training, initiatives in the areas of the arts, culture and sports and community endeavours. The process to facilitate financial inclusion and membership in the national pension scheme is being developed. A total of 9,491 savings accounts have been opened for former combatants to enable them to receive financial support, in line with the provisions of the Agreement. Up to 30 August, disbursements equivalent to nearly $8 million had been made, and 3,840 national pension scheme memberships had been finalized. The national apprenticeship service has started providing support covering financial education, community project management, entrepreneurship, solidarity-based economics, integrated solid waste management and information and communication technology. It is very important to note, as has been highlighted here, that a special reintegration programme for minors was established, known as “A Different Way of Life”. It is a specialized programme that recognizes them as victims, seeks the restoration of their rights, comprehensive reparations and social and economic reintegration. It provides support not just to the minors themselves, but to their families, host communities and relevant institutions. The Government of Colombia is aware of the immense challenge of carrying out those tasks and the coordination it will require — that too has been mentioned here. However, we remain willing and we honour our decision to implement the Agreement swiftly and efficiently so as to achieve the goal of stable and lasting peace. In conclusion, I am grateful for the expressions of support following the recent announcement by my Government and the Ejército de Liberación Nacional to begin a temporary bilateral ceasefire on 1 October, which will last for 102 days. In that regard, President Santos Calderón has submitted a request to the Secretary-General that the United Nations be part of the oversight of the temporary agreement. That piece of good news fills us with hope and renews our faith in a Colombia where coexistence prevails. That faith was mentioned here and by Pope Francis yesterday before departing from his five-day visit to Colombia. Peace is a duty that does not concede defeat. It demands everyone’s commitment, despite obstacles, differences and the various approaches to achieve peaceful coexistence, and persists in the struggle to foster the “culture of encounter”.

I now invite Council members to informal consultations to continue our discussion of the subject.