S/PV.14 Security Council

Item 2 deals with the letter from the Hèad of the Ukrainian SSR delegation to the President of the Security Council, dated 21 January 1946. 1 calI upon Mr. Manui1sky, representative of the Ukrainian Soviet Socialist Republic, to take a seat at the Council table. ----~,.. ~. Mr. VYSHINSKY (Union of Soviet Socialist Republics) (translated trom Russian) : NO:E: The following is a translation of a Rus- sza.n text of Mr. TTyshinsky's statement sup,: plzed hy the representative of the Soviet Union after the meeting. . .. The Ukrainian delegation has presented for cialistes NOTE: Y. 1See .official Records of the Security Council, First ear, Fust Series, Supplement No. 1; Annex 4. PreID1ère Annexe 2 Ibid., Annex 5· • Ibid., Annex9' •Ibid., Supplem~nt No. 2, Annex 1. 1 should Iike to explain briefly the point of view of the Soviet delegation on this question, as far as possible without repeating myself, and 1 shall even set myself the task of avoiding any repetition. Nevertheless, in some cases, 1 am bound to do this and l request your'indulgellce beforehand. Whàt are the questions wlûch the Ukrainian delegation has taised? The first question amounU to ~, that the British troops in Indoilesia wh() arrived there with the common consent of the Allies in order to· carry out the âisarming of the Japanese forces and to receive the capitulation of the Japanese troops, in accordance with Gen- eral Order No. 1 of General MacArthur, are usiilg armed force against the national libera- tion movemènt of the Indonesian people. These facts are denied by the British and Netherlands delegations and 1 shall deal with them in par- ticular'làter on. But 1 must say that the mere denial of the facts adduced by the Ukrainian delegation provesnothing. The fact of the use of British troops. in Indonesia against· the Indo- nesian national liberation movement; what- ev~ labels may be used to vilify the' people or to designate the movement, isaltogether intoler- able. It is contrary to the principle$ of national self-determination approved by the United Na- tions, as expressedin the Charter ot the United Nations. The head of the Ukt:ainian delegation, Dr. ManuiIsky~ submitted a number of factscon- firming the situation he described. These facts had been published in the press, including the press of'Britain, America and -other countrÏes. They had beenthesubjectofdebates in the legislativeassemblies of various countries, in- cluding the British House 01 Commons. These factsare known to :t1tewholeworldand, to talk seriously, .really seriously,. and ,one cannat talkotherwise about these facts, it is impossible to agree with the arguments puts. forward .here to xefute the state~entof the Ukrainiandelega- don. Infact, what did theseobjections amount ta? To· use the military term "attack," ·.they amounted .to light .counter-attacks with light :weapons against .the heavy weapons of the Ukrainian delegation's attacks.But itis well known that.heavy attaclœ .cannot be beaten off with .light weapons, although this wow,d bean amusingsight.· . Atfirst Mr. Bevin said hedidnotknow what answer •.was expected of him, .although' it.is not haI'dtoguesswhatanswer is expectedto the Ukrainiandelegation'sstatement. ThenMr. . Finally, Mr. Bevin merely stated that the facts . adduced by the Ukrainian delegation regarding the use of British troops against the Indonesian population were false and that, in general, the facts adduced by Mr. Manuilsky were incorrect and were directed agaiIl.st Mr. Manuilsky him- self. Mr. Bevin maintained, moreover, that the press reports and speeches of members of Parlia- ment and other authoritative persons prove that there is such a thing as freedom of the press in England, and· that everyone may say whatever he Iikes. But the fact that there is such a thing as freedom of the press in England is evidence that it exists in order that the press should be respected and that it should be treated more seriously and with greater dignity. The facts ad- ducecl by the Ukrainian delegation are disputed chiefly because they are derived from press re- ports. But what other course is open?,From what source are the facts regarding events,in any part of the globe to be derived when there are no other possibilities of ascertaining what is hap- pening there except from .reports in the press? ln fact, the British and Netherlands delega- tions enjoy a better position in regard to Indo-· nesia, 1 would say, a privileged position. They have of course other sources of information at their disposaI. They have their armed forces in Indonesia; they have their agenciesand in- formers in Indonesia; they receive information, communications, reports·and memoranda; they probablyreceive whole libraries, containing 'books and documents describing what is .hap- pening out there. But how,can this be known to the other Members of thé United Nations, if the rest of the Members in whose name the British troops are acting in Indonesia, have no possibility of being informed, except from, press reports, regarding the .conflict that is taking place there? That is why 1 ~ake the liberty of saying that the charge against .the ,Ukrainian delegation. of ha~g availed itself of press re- port~ is ill~founded and unjUst. There is ~ means of obtainingfirst-hand in- formation without having recou';::,;;; ta press re- ports. Itconsists inse:rIding o,ut i:.l Indoneciaa commission to investigatewhat isbeing done there,. to .question the peopl; y('nom lt is neces- sa to ,question, to obtain palpd}i,:~ evidencé of . Such is the dilemma, such is the. alternative, and there is no third solution. Tertium non datuf. With regard to the proposai of the Ukrainian delegation to appoint a commission to obtain the necessary illformation on the spot, Ml'. van Kleffens said last time that if the Ukrainian delegation wished ta receive infdrmation, the Netherlands delegation would willingly supply it tbroügh diplomatie channels or in sorne other way~ But we know quite weIl what this meam in reality a.Tld what kind of-information is often provided through these so-called .diplomatic channels. Anyway., this dc~s nat exclude the necessity of using other means which would pro- vide better grounds for a critical attitude to- wards the facts advanced. Instead of seeing .things with ones'own eyes, arr-.d obtaining information ftom fust sources, or, as 1·have.said,.at first hand, ithas been proposed hel'é <1gain to limitoneself and be satisfiedwith obtaining informationatsecond-hand.-But this is an absolute!y illogical proposai. In view parti- cularly of the .fact that 1.am in Great Britain, ·CciÙlltrywhich .has produced -many remarkal>le ruIcs forestablishin.g facts in the domain of SQ- called legal evidence; _1 must refer ta such eIni- nent aathorities ·as .Bp.;ltham and Wills,· who cteachthat whenever it is necessa.ry toèonfirm_ facts; M.t sources must. beused because they pr()vide the "bestevidencet and that the best evidence and notthe worstevidence must al- ways be used; itis Wf'J1 known that, a copy a!ways i.'1ferior ta the origin.al. It Ï8 w~llknown that evidence at secoI1clor tlilid handis~ways Indeed the prc;'Jsal tabl~d by Mr. van Kleffens obviously rueans that he does not want to admit a commission to Indonesia. This is the danger that Mr. van Kleffens so much fears-a commission! But how can such a stubborn tend- ency not to admit a commission to Indonesia be interpreted? There is no doubt bui: that it will be understood, and cannot be understood otherwise than as. a desire not to admit to Indo- nesia a ray of light, to leave everything in that black ObSCUi-ity which largely covers Indonesian affairs at present. We are against this. We are against secrecy in Indonesian and other affairs of the same kind. We are in favour of everything being ciear. We are in faveur of everything being open. We are in favour, as Mr. Bevin frequently. says" of putting aIl the documents on the table. It will, therefore, be better if an impartial and authoritative commission tacklesthe matter. However, let us return to Indonesia its~. 1 consider, and the Soviet delegation, expressing the opinion.of the Soviet Government; aIso con- siders~ that the facts as cited by the Ukrainian delegation :remain unshaken and unrefuted. Surely it is a fact that military operations are taking place in Indonesia. Surely it is a fact that what has been called by The Times (1 apologize ta Mr. Bevin for referring to the British press) a "near war" is taking place in Indonesia, or that on 11 December a member of Parliament, Mr. Platt~Mills, made the following statement in ParIiament: . . . "1 ask whether it is suggested that there is sorne agreement, kept secret sa far, which requires us ta be there and to intervene in what·is becomiIlg a blocdy war on behalf of the Dutch Empire. It is not a case where the peâce of the world is thceatened. The peace is broken," seid.the honoUl'able Member of Par" liament, "destroyed already, the wat is on". Last. time, MX.. Bevin said inhis speech tr â.ccording to the vohminous literature which he had read,the British are in Indonesia fer evil purpos.es~ of varipus-kinds, as an imperialistic power. .i.v.fr. Bevm added that a circumstance which made him fee1 somewhat nervous was.that whenhe.examined the. whole affairwith Mr. .Molotov,. line by line; not a worcl was said to The People's Commissar for Foreign Mairs, Mr. V. 1. Molotov, thllS said that the events Indonesia called to mind a new war. Indeed, this war is in p,rogress and thousands of people have already been killed in Bandoeng, Soerabaya and Semerang; it was reported quite recently, on 15 January, from Scügon, that tierce clashes had taken place between the Anglo-Indian troops and Indonesian detachments." And under these very conditions, Mr. van KIeffens ventures express "regret, not because thousands have been killed, but because British troops display ceptional patience; this is apparently to understood as meaning that the number persons" killed is not yet sufficient for Mr. van Kleffens to admit that military operations taking place in Indonesia. • It is impossible notto take note of a fact such cas the'information from the Hague that entire contingent of Dutch troops of the 1945 call-up, alltheinfantry, tanks and artillery ':regi- ments newly re-formed of the men being called up,must be trained by May of this year and despatchedtoIndonesia. Thisfact attracts attf'n- tion because, obviously, in the. opinion of Dutch Government, circumstanceswill develop in the future in such a manner that troops will berequired over there to put thingsin order to use a-common '.expression, to "restore order". Itis, therefore, intendedtodespatchtolndo- nesia larger anned, forces than are there at pres- ent, in order, as Mr. van KIeffens said, that these troopsshould not takea rest out there, butthat ,theyshoul&act.It isapparent that more Wide- spread military op~rationsare being prepared Indonesia against the Indonesians' and this, tum, .is fraught wïth dangerous consequences which threaten peace and security. Itis inlpos- sible to agree W;Ïth the statementtha.t the des- patch to Indonesia' ofarmed forces is not- recteg agajr)st the Indonesian people~against the natioilai liberationmovement, Lut agmnst some nésie ristes", lesquels l'ordre, armées de M. s'agit nous sommes Il ment hommes moderne, ne et organisée clarer peuple indonésien est en cours. disons. lourds l'étincelle qui provoquera l'incendie de Nous et actuellement menace pour tient venir se provoque'laperte finir dans ses quoi nésie la l'Organisation mesures d'intervention que nous envisageons sont des passe qu'une d'y diquer les mesures qui s'imposent. Attempts are being made to represe.llt every- thing that is taking place in Indonesia as the sallies of "extremists" and "terrol'ists," the sallies of a handful of people, against whom all efforts are concentrated for the re-establishment of arder and the armed forces of Great Britain and HCllland are being despatched. Mr. vm Kleffens himself said that it was not a question of a few "bands" but of an entire mmy. He said that these so-caTIed extremists made up an army of nearly eighty thousand, that they were armed with the latest weapons including A.A. guns. This is not a smaU group of terrorists and ex- tremists, not a band, but an organized army of the people of Indonesia. It should. be stated openly that war isbeing waged against the In- donesian people. This is what we are saying. Such events are dangerous and fraughtwith danger for the future. This may be the spark whîch in future will burst into the flame of war. And we consider it necessary to point this out loudly and clearly and to say that the events which are at the moment taking place in Indo- nesia contain a threat to peace and tosecurity, and that it is the duty of an international or- ganization ~o prevent this danger and to put an end to the tragedy which is at present being staged in Indonesia and is costing human lives. An end must be put to these military actions wmch are takingplace in a country which is of some size, with a population of seventy millions. This is why 1 insist that first, the oituation in Indonesia isprecisely one that is pi'Ovided for in the Charter, and it is impossible here to dispense with the intervention of our Organization. We are taking the minimum steps for such an inter- vention. We want to know what is in fact hap- pening there.· We insist that a commission be sent which will objectively study the situation and outline the measures which it is imperative ta fake. ~~ ~; ~ What is the strugglein Indonesia about? In the name of what are bloody clashes taking place out there? Ihad occasionrecently to obtain a quelles produis~nt-ils? une nationale indonésienne l'Indonésie nant mon per~odical wmch is being issued by the Indo- neSIan National Association in Holland, The Voice ot Free lndonesia. It pOOts an article which, it seen-.tS to me,must be of interest ta the Security Council, in connexion with the 1 think this aIone throws sufficient light upon the ends pursued by the Indonesian natiomù libertltion movement, which cannot be con- nected with a few adventurers. 1 stress "with few,u sirice 99.9 per cent of the entire Indo- nesian people stand for liberty, for national dependence, for their Republic and for the right of self-determination, and expect and ask support on the part of the United Nations Or- ganization in conformity with the principles pro- claimed by the United Nations Charter. We are told that this is not the business of the United Nations, and that the Charter in no way contemplates the possibility of intervention in matter of tItiS kind. 1 cannot agree with this. Chapter 1 of the United Nations Organization Charter, devoted to the aims and principles this Organization, to wit, in Article 1, paragraph 2, it is stated quite preclsely and de:finitely that one of the aims of the Organization is "to ve10p friend1y relations among nations based respect for the principle of equal rights and self- determination of peoples, .~d .to take other appropriate measures ta 8tren@1en universal peace". In Article 1, paragraph 4~ which refers to the purposes and principles of the United Nations Organization, it is pointed out that one of the aims and objects of this Organization "to be a centre for harmonizingthe actions of na- . tions in the attainment of these common ends". The United Nations Organization itself is called upon to be a centre which unites. the efforts all democratic and free countries fOf co-ordinat- ing these actions and for solving all 'problems set.out in· Chapter 1. We are being referred Â-ticle 2, paragraph 7, of theCharter,·in an tempt tp prove that the events in Indonesia an internaI matter andthatthe Organization has no right to interfere'in suchmatters, as otherwise, as Mr. Bevin put it~ the sovereign rights Ho]Jànd would be impaired. 'But these objections are quite unfounded. Article 2, paragraph refers to matt~which~reessential1y·within domestic j~dictionofa State.There are mat,;, ters~ however, which though formally comprise.d· in thedomestic jurisdictionof agiven Sta.te, border uponcxternal poIitical relatiom, or'even encroach· directIy uponexternal·· political .. r:ela- tions,. threatening. the. peace and .s~curity of the peoples.SuchJ.'Datters cannotbe Idt to b~ sçt- tled. by.· the .•State, itself, notwithstandingth.e principle of sovereignty. ·Doesnotthe Charler represent .certain .lirpitatioits of:.sovereignty· feren~e in the internal affairs of Greece? How is it that this is not an infringement of the say- ereignty of Greece, an allied State? If a commis- sion can he sent to Greece to control the clec- tions, as has been done by Great Britain and the United States of America, why cannot a com- mission be sent to Indonesia? How was it that the commission on Polish affairs, consisting of Mr. V. 1. Molotov, Sir Archibald Clark Kerr and Mr. Harriman, was not an infringement of the sovereignty of the Polish Republic? Why is Sir Archibald Clark Kerr's mission to Indonesia not an interference by Great Britain in the inter- nal affairs of Holland? Why do Mr. Bevin, the Foreign Office and the British Governme.'1t deem it possible to seud Sir Archibald Clark Kerr to lndonesia with a view to settIe lndonesian mat- ters jointIy with the Dutch and the I:p.donesians, as Mr. Bevin has informed us here? We cannot follow that road. This impairs the equality of the States Members of the United Nations Or- ganization. If Sir Archibald' Clark Kerr could go. to Indonesia, why cannot representatives of the Soviet Union, of the United States, China or any other State designated by the Security Council go there? Whence this in.equality? Can , unity of the Organization exist, if some States enjoy privileges as compared with other States, whith do not possess evèn rights? This is a faulty basis, and to defend that basis is equiva- l::nt to sapping the very foundations of the Unitèd Nations Organization. We are opposed to this inequality within the United Nations Organization. . Ml'. van Kleffens has said that when theques:- tion arose of sel1~g Dutch troops to Indonesia, there was no shipping available for transporting the. British and Dutch troops, and that for this reason it served no usefu! purpo~e to send "half- starved Dutchmen.instead of well-trained British troops." . Was perhaps the reason for sending a British diplomat·to Indonesia, that there was nôswtable Dutch cJiplomat available, as in the caf.le of the despatch of troops? ?reece provedincapable of exercising her sov- erelgnty, and the United States and Britain dis- patched a cùmmission there. Roumania pl"oving unable tosolvealI her problems, a commission composed of Sir Archibald Clark Kerr, Mr. Harriman and Mr. Vyahinsky was sent there Now, in concluSion, a last point, which con- cerns the use of Japanese troops against Indonesians. What is the actmù position in matter? 1 think that asa result of the statements made here and of the information to which have Iistened, it may be saidthat the fact of the use of Japariese arttled forces againstthe Indo- nesian people has been established. It is that Mr. Bevin did not say this, but Ml'. .Kleffens did, and so did Ml'. Noel-Baker in House of Commo~, when admitting that Jap- anesetroops had oeen used against the Indo- nesiai.'1 people, but that this had been called for, it was said, "for defensive purposes." It may, therefore, be considered established that .Jap- anese troops were usedagainst the Indonesian population. Attem.pts are- being made tà give thïsfacta, plausible explanation. 1 think it neces- sary to recall thafOrder. No. 1 was issued General MacArthur in agreement with Allies, including the Soviet Union, but that order did not. provide for the use of Japanese forces for .purposes of t~Jcind. Japanese forces, accorqing .to this ord~r".w~re t()sl1rr~ntlerllI)­ conditionally ~dbe.• disarmed..There '.could no. question ofleaving· in their hands weapons andhaving theseweapons used against the Ind()- nes~anpopti1ation.- This is adirect breach of agreement onthe.basisof· 'Which MacArthur's ot1der wasissued; This îs' a connivance of The proposai of the Ukrainian' delegation on the despatch of a commission, an authoritative commission which should be composed of repre- sentatives of Great Britain, the United States of America, CJ:aJna,the Netherlands and the Soviet Union, and which could ascertain the situation impartiaUy and objectively and bring relief to our perturbed public opinion, is absolutely necessary. This would tend to foster mutual un- derstanding. No one's sovereignty would be infringed. This would serve to strengthen that unity of the Organization and those principles which are the foundation of the United Nations Organization.

1 think that this rnight possibly be a sudtable moment for us to adjoum. What time would the Council like to reassemble? It has been suggested to me that 3.30 p.m. would be a suitable time.· 1 would suggest that we endeavour to undertake our duties punctually at half-past three this afternoon. The Council rose at 1.40 p.m. FIFTEENTH MEETING Held at Church House, Westminster, London, on Sunday, 10 February 1!'46, at 3.30 p.m. , President: Mr. N. J. O. MAKIN (Australia). Present: The representatives of the following countries: Australia, Brazil, China, Egypt, France, Mexico, Netherlands, Poland, Union of Socialist Soviet Republics, United Kingdom, United States of America. 61. Continuation of discussion of the letter from the Head of the Ukrainian SSR delegation1 Mr. RIAz .(Egypt) (translated from French) : The question now before us has two qudte dis-