S/PV.214 Security Council

Before calling on the next speaker, I feel obliged to make one or two observations on our procedui'e. Some of my colleagues have indicated to me·that they have some doubt as· to the exact course of this discussion=-whether we. are still engaged in a general discussion of the question, whether we are discussing the report of ·the Consular Commission, or whether we should be discussing various draft resolutions which have already been put forward. I am afraid it is true that the discussion has dragged on for a long time while the local situation in Java shows no notabl~ improvement. I am sure that all members of the Security Council will agree with me that while we must, of course, have a fuil discussion, it is important to try to reach some conclusion within a reasonable time. I consider that we are·still engaged in a general discussion, in the course of which any member may, of course, either refer to the general situa:- tion or discuss any point of the Consular Commission's report ·which he chooses or, indeed, comment on the draft resolutions which have bF~ submitted. Blit meanwhile I suggest that those members who wish to present resolutions or ahy formal amendments to resolutions already before us, should submit the texts of such proposals as soon as possible, eithel today ct" tomorrow. I would also ask those members of the .Council who wish to take further part in the .general disettssion to submit their names before our next meeting, .or .at· least in the course 9f our next meeting. Thus, by the end of that meeting, we might be able to close the list of speakers for the general discussion. We should then know where we were and when it wmtld be possible to take into cOilsideration the draft resolutions before the Council and put them to a vote. I hope that my colleagues will agree that this is a ..easonable procedure. . Mr. AUSTIN (United States of America).: The Council has now had an opp<>rtunity to examine the report of the ConsUlar Commission. At the same time, I unclei'stand that our Committee of Good Offi'~eshas an'i\,oo hI lndonesi~ We ought to beprepar.ed to take 1" &cEsion on t~is ques- M. AUSTIN (Etats-Unis d'Amerique) (traduit de l'anglais): Le Conseil a pu maintenant e~a· miner le rapport de la Commission consula~re, D'autre part, si je ne m'abuse, notre commisst~O de bons'offices est arrivee en Indonesie. Si n6US voulons jouer un role utile, nottS devons etr~ Assuming that the hatched line represents the line· reached on 5 August 1947, which I assume to be the date of our cease-fire order so far as the two parties to the dispute are concerned, there is no frontier. There are sporadic ba~les and battle lines, and they are quite irrero.dar. The opposing forces are not confronting each other. As for what have been called "spearheads"l this may be a correct description, but it is not what I thought it meant. I had an idea of a frontier,· a· battle line from which spearheads were advanced into the enemy's territory; btit there are so many different terrItories and different lines here that the situation is quite different from· that given by the. oral description of a battle in which spearheads had been run out and a mopping-up process undertaken to gain occupancy or control of the gores between those spearheads. From an examination. of these maps, the condition in both islands is apparently such that there is no probability at all of moppingup operations which will unite the areas so that they will all, in the legal and international sense, be in the occupancy of one side, or actually geographically united. . What does .that mean as far as the Security Council is concerned? I think it means that we should be unwise to attempt to resolve the complicated military question, which is the question to which the Council must give priority. I stand, therefore, on the statement I made to the Council at its two hundred·and thirteenth meeting and upon the basic principles of the draft resolution which I put forward at that time. .I thinkotir best hope for success in attaining our ultimate objective in this case is to place the matter in the hands" of our Committee of Good Offices. In our opinion, the report in general CODfirms and supports the summary conclusion'> whicl. the Consular Commission sent to us in its telegram of 11 October; the text of which appears as chapter IV of the report. e~al Sp~or. This testimony, contained in appendix I ...' , :emple, les paroles d'un b~moin qui est, je 'VIII, ~V'es me the same impression that the ret.us, le general Spoor. Ce temoignage, qui figure port gIves: a l'annexe VIII, me donne la meme impression que le rapport: . "Reply: I think they had better move out. I know, however,it does not apply to military -law. According to international law, a country or territory :s considered occupied when the occupying forces are able to send troops in, wherever and whenever, to control the country. The same is true her~. "Commi.ssioll: The point is this-that supposing there is a Republican' formation behind your lines. That fornlation has been ordered to stand fast and to cease fire but it is presumably entitled.to. receive supplies and rations from its own territory and therefore, if you consider it to be a breach of cease-fire for the Republicans to attack your lines of communication, would it not also be a breach of cease-fire for you to attack theirs even though that is within your line? "Reply: Quite right. If it is true that these formations are ordered to cease fighting-but that makes all the difference, because if they would stand fast and keep quiet, then we could come to some arrangement. But they are ordered to fight and to attack.' "Co11t1nis.rion: Do you consider your mopping-up operations likely to be interpreted by the· Republic to be a breach of the cease-fire by the other side? "Reply: I an~ sure they will, because we know , that the Republican side considers it this way. For instance, in the Tasikmalaja area and several . other places we occupied certain posts on 4 August at 2400 hours and when on6 August we went to sec1,1re another place in Tasikmalaja, the Republic considered this ,as a breach of the cease-fire order· because we did ·.not stand fast." . That is a situation which has peculiarities that we are unable to handle right here, far away from the scene and far away from more available facts. . . In our opinion, then, the .report in general confirms· and supports the summary conclusions which the Consular Commission sent to us in. a telegram 01 11 October and which appear as chap~ ter, IV of the report. It fills in a good many of the detail!? for u.s and provides essential information on which it is possible for us to take action.. It is apparent that, while major military action! has ceased in accordanre with our resoIutioL c:::.H- . ing for a Cease-fire, hostilities are continuing "i"ith I substantial loss of life on both sides. Our re <+.!- i tion calHng for a cease-fire is really not yet. tiny i effective. . The report of the consuls indicates. that the .major source of difficulty in bringing about a cessation of hostilities has .been the difference of opinion between the parties as to the proper. in- "Ve believe that the forces of either party are entitled to remain undisturbed in the positions which they held on 4 August. It is my view that, it would be advisable for the Council to clarify its resolution of 1 August along the above lines. In fact, it seems to me that it will be extremelydifficult for our Committee of Good Offices to be of assistance'to the parties in reaching agreement on the cessation of hostilities unless the Security, Council has .in advance advised the parties and the Committee as to the proper interpretation. of that resolution. Even with this clarification, it seems clear that the parties and the Committee of Good Offices will face' a very confused. and difficult situation during the peiiod before an agreement has been reached for an effective truce. The report of the Consular Commission indicates that the Indonesians claim that between -S August and 26 September, the Netherlands h~<i violated the resolution calling fora cease-fire in 811 specific instances; on the other hand, according to the Netherlands, the Indonesians had violated the re~olution calling for a cease-fire in 1,792 specific instances during the same period. Moreover, the consuls' report is replete with instances where one or the other party considered itself justified in particular cases in taking military action which could. be held to be a technical violation of the cease-fire order. In addition, -certain specific cases have been mentioned in the Council where it seems clear that technical violations for one or another. reason might be justified. As has been pointed out, with the best of goodwill it has been and will undoubtedly continue to be impossible for each party to know in a particular situation whether in taking certain action it is technically violating the'Council's resolution f)f 1 August, or whether the existing circumstances justify such il.ction.. There again I think we must rely upon our representatives on the spot to help the parties and the Council reach a solution of these problems. De plus, on a signale au ,Conseil certains ··r::tf precis dans lesquels, cl ce qu'il semble,. de .qua~;, infractions de ce genre pourraient se justifier.a quelque titre. Comme on l'a fait )bserver, les . deux. parties en cause, avec la meilleure volonte, du monde, se' trouveront· dans l'impossibilite .a l'avenir, tout comme eUes 1'0nt ete dans le passe, de determiner si, dans une situation donnee, eUes commettent, en prenant certaines mesures, une quasi-infraction a la resolutiortdu Conseil en date du 1er aotit, ou si le:; circonstances justifient les dites mesures. La encore, je crnis que nous devons laisser cl nos representants qui se trouyent sur les. lieux. le soin d'aider les ,parties intel'essees et le Conseil aresoudre ces problemes. Notre Commissjon de bons offices est sur place, je crois, et prete a remplir cette mission. LIes cas particuliers de cette n.ature, qui sont as~\ez importants. pour meriter un examen special, seront naturellement portes a l'attention de la Commission de bons offices ou de la Commission COll.SU- Our Committee of GOl).d Offices, I understand, has arrived and is available,for such a purpose. Particular cases of this nature, which are 'important enough to warrant special consideration, will, of.course, be brought to·the attention of the Com:" mlttee or of the Consular Commission~ Such cases In the second paragraph, I ~ow refer to "report" instead of "summary of the report". ' In. the third paragraph, I have taken out the words "directly or indirectly". That is because I n~w ,recogni~e, after hearing stateme~ts here and reading this r.eport, that there may be sped~l occasion& which look like technical violations, but which are not really such and should not be .so treated. ' The next two patagrap~s remain the same. However, I hav~ added a last paragraph on the subject of interpretation. It is as follows: I might say in passing that our attitude as to what is "under its control" is not exactly the same , 1 The 'following is the text of the revised draft resolution submitted by the representative of the United States: "Voici le texte revise du projet de resolution soumis par le representant des Etats~Unis: Document S/588 27 October ,1947 Document S/558 27 .octobre 1947 H avil~g received and takm lIote of the report of the Con- sular Commission dated ,14 October 1947, indicating that the Council's resolution of 1 August 1947, relating to the cessation of hostilities, has not been fully effective; Havillg taken lIote that according to the report· no at- tempt was made by either side to come to an agreement with the other about the means of giving effect to that res:olution; Calls upon the parties concerned forthwith to consJ11t Invite les partie~ in,tere;;~ees a se consulter im~ediat~- with each other as to the means to be employed in order to ment sur les moyens a utIliser pour donner effet a la re- give effect to the case-fire resoluti,onand pending, agree-, solution concernant la £essation du feu, et, en attendant la, ment to cease any activities which contravene that res- realisation d'un accord, de mettre fin a toutes les activites olution;' qui vonl: al'encontre de cette resolution: Requests the Committee of Good Offices'to assist the Prie la 'Commission de bon offices cl'aider les parties a partit:s in reaching agreement on an arrangement which arriver a un accord sur les ,dispositions qui permettront will ensure the observ~nce of .the cease-fire resolution;, d'appliquer la resolution concernant la cessation du £eu; Requests the' Consular Commission, together with its Pyie la Commission consulaire de mettre ses serviCes, military assistants, to make its services available to the ainsi queceux de ces adjoints militaires, a"la disposition Committee of Good Offices; de la Commission de bons offices; Advises'the parties concerned, the Committee of Good 'Fait co1t1uzUre aux parties'interessee, a la Commission Offices and the Consular Commission that its resolution de bons offices et a la Commission consulaire qu'elles of 1 August should be interpreted as not permitting the use doivent interpreter sa resolution du ler' aout comme in- of the armed forces of either party by military action to terdisant a l'une DU l'autre partie de recouvir a la .f~rce alt€r substantially the territory under its control on 4 armee dans le cadre d'operations militaires pour modifier :' !gust 1947. '". substantiellement le territoire qui etait soumis a leur ~ , controle ala date du 4 aout 1941~ ...... l~ur controle a la date du 4 aout 1947". J~ ferai remarquer inddemment que nons ne ' sommes pas exactenient du meme avis 'que le ge- A:\'ant ete saisi etayal~t prls acte du rapport de la O>m- mission consulaire en date du 14 octobre 1947, indiquant que la resolution du Consei! du ler aout 1947 relative a. la cessation des hostilites n'a pas ete' completement suivie . d'effet; , ,Ayallt pris acte de.ce que ~e rapport signale q1A~ ._, deux parties n'ont fait aucune tentative pour conc1ure un accord sur les moyens de donner effe~ acette resolution; ~he use of military force to ob!ain control o~ those gores between spearhea~s whIch were not m any way. occupied by armed forces. ';)11 4 August. We are forced into taking that posItIOn largely by ~he picture that is before us of these areas separatmg the different battle fronts.

If there is no objection, I propose to adjourn the ~eeting. It will be diffi~ult to arrange for a meeting tomorrow, as the -FIrst Committee meets in the morning and afternoon. The Council will meet on Wednesday, 29 October} at 3 p.m., if there is no objection. Will members who desire to take part in the discussion kindly submit their names, if possible, before the next meeting. Also, I should be greatly obliged to members who have draft resolutions or amendments to propose, if they would put them in writing before the next meeting. La seance est levee a18 h. 05. FRANCE Editions A. PedoDe 13, rue Soumot PARIS, ye GREECE-GRECE "Eleftheroudakis" Librairie intemationale Place de la Constitution ATHENES GUATEMALA Jose Goubaud Goubaud & Cia. Ltda. Sucesor Sa Av. SOl' No. 6 y 9a C. P. GUATEMALA HAITI Max Bouchereau Librairie "A la Caravelle" BOlte postale 111·B ' PORT-AU·PRINCE ICELAND-ISLANDE Bokaverzlun Sigfuear Eymund8Qnnar Austurstreti 18 REYKJAVIK INDIA-INDE Oxford Book & Stationery Company Scindia House NEW DELHI IRAN Bongahe Piade!ow 731 Shah A,renue TEHERAN IRAQ-IRAK :Mackenzie & Mackenzie The Bookshop BAGHDAD LEBANON-LlBAN Librairie universelle BEYROUTH LUXEMBOURG Librairie J. Schunimer Place Guillaume LUXEMBOURG DEN~RK-DANEMARK Einar Munksgaard NI:THERLAND5-PAYS·BAS N. Y. MarOOus Nijhoff Lange Yoorhout 9 'S-GRAVENHAGE N~rregade6 KPBENHAVN DOMINICAN REPUBLIC- REPUBUQUE DOMIN!CAINE Libreria Dominicana Calle Mercedes No. 49 Apiutal!o 656 CWDAIJ TRUJILLO ECUADOR-EQUATEUR Mufioz Hennanos y Cie,. Nueve de Octubre 703 Casilla 10·24 GUAYAQUIL NEW ZEALAND- NOUVELLE·ZELANDE Gordon & Goteh, Ltd. Waring Taylor Street WELLINGTON United Nations Association of New Zealand P. O. 1011, G.P.O. WELLINGTON NICARAGUA Ramiro Ramirez V. Agenda de Publicaciones MANAGUA, D. N. EGYPT-~GYPTE .. Librairie"La Renaissance d'Egypte" 9 Sh. Adly Pasha CAIRO ETHIOPIA-El'HIOPIE Agence ethiopienne de publicite P. O. Box 8 ADDIS·ABEBA NORWAY-NORVEGE Johan Grundt Tanum Forlag Kr. Augustgt. 7A OSLO PHILIPPINES . DC:P. Perez Co. 132 Riverside SAN JUAN, RIZAL POLAND-POLOGNE Spotdzielna Wydawnicza "Czytelnik" 38 Poznanska WARSZAWA SWEDEN-SUEDE A.-B, C. E. Fritzes Kungl. { Hofbokhandel Fredsgatan 2 STOCKHOLM SWITZERLAND-SUISSE Librairie Payot S. A. LAUSANNE, GENEVE,. YEVEY, MONTREUX, NEUCH.hEL, BERNE, BASEL Hans Ralmhardt Kirchgasse 17 . ZURICH ~ SYRIA-SYRIE Librairie universelle DAMAS iURKEY-TURQUIE Librairie Hachette 469 Istiklal Caddesi BEYOGLU·lsTANBUL UNION OF SOUTH AFRICA- UNION SUD·AFRICAINE Central News Agency Commissioner & Rissik 8ts. JOHANNESBURG and at CAPETOWN and DURBAN UNITED KINGDOM- ROYAUME·UNI H. M. Stationery Office P. O. Box 569 LONDON, S.E. 1 and at H.M.S.O. Shop" in LONDON, EDINBURGH, MANCHESTE CARDIFF, BELFAST, BIRMINGHAM and BRISTOL UNITED STATES OF AMERICA- ETATS·UNIS D'AMERIQUE International Documents Service Columbia University Press 2960 Broadway NEW YORK 27, N. Y. URUGUAY Oficina de Representacion de Editoriales Av. 18 de Julio 1333 Esc. 1 MONTEVIDEO VENEZUELA Escritoria Perez Machado Conde a Pifiango 11 CARACAS YUGOSLAVIA-YOUGOSLAVIE Drzavno Preduzece Jugoslovenska Knjiga. Moskovska Ul. 36 BEOGRAD