S/PV.366 Security Council

Yeso General McNAUGHTON (Canada); 1 should like to take this opportunity :to express the most sincere appreeiation of the manner in which the President of the Security Council has carried forward the great res.ponsibilities which fell npon him when he accep'ted the presidency of this Coundl for the consideration of the grave issues which are before us today. 1 know that 1 can speak not only for myself but aIs,) for the other members who hav;e been associated with the President in the talks which he has had, in expressing our -confidence in the wisdom and initiative which he has shown. 1 have no douM that, in ,the course of our discussions, the President will give the Security Council an account of these talks. These informaI talks in which the Secur- Hy Council r~presentatives of Argentina, Belgium, Canada, China, Colombia and Syria -have heen engaged since the last meeting of the Conncil on the subject of Berlin [36ftPt, mee.tiilg] , have had as theiT pl1rpose thegathering of full information coilcerning the points of view of the parties concerned with the problem. In thr.-se conversations .we haw~ also sought to clarify the issues involVied. In view of the gravity and complexity of lhese issues,- it has seeme-d to us that we have the serious reSiponsibility of examin:.g thematters in aU their varied aspects and W!.t~ t1:le help of aU the information which we ean -secure. -As -:Members of the United Nations, and ,part1cularlybecause we hold the privi1ege of menibership in the Security Couneil, the In ollder that there may be no rnisconceplion of what we h~ve been seeking to do, 1 should like to em.phasize tha:t we have not been concerned with producing any offer of mediation or with th·e drafting of resolutions of whatev.er charactel' to be placed befol1e the Security Council. Our work to date has heen strictly explûratory and preliminary, beeause we recognize that it is here in the Security Council :that deeisions must be taken. . May 1 say again that l helieve il to he theduty of the Security Council ,to l'eaçh conclusions and to take appropriate decisions promptly, for the situation is that we are carrying on ,this debate under the shadow of violence. The specifie questions whith 1 understand the President has ,put to the :vepr-.sentatives of France, the Union of Sovie. Socialist Republics, the United Kingdom and the United States, have emerged from our discussions as points upon which we desire further enlightenment. 1 hope that aIl concerned will tak!e advantage of this oppor- ,tunity to make this further information' available so that work in the Security Council may proceed promptly. .Ml'. URDANETA-ARBELAEZ (Colombia) (translaled {rom S,panish) : On hehalf of the Colombian delegation, 1 wish heœ and now ta associate myself with the S'taternent made by the representative of Canada. In the grave problem at ,pœsent under consideration hy. the Security Council-a problem which has ,perturbed the minds of people throughout the world-the six member States of this Council which arE: not dîrectly involved in the matter have tl'ied ,to their utmost ability to do their duty hy .co-oPferating by every means at their dispos·al, in conformity with 1!he desir.es of the 'p,eoples of the world, for the peaceful and amicable settlement of ,the difficulties wlüch have arisen between the Great Powers. With that end in view, we hav,e tried since "the outset ,to obtain full information on aIl aspects of the matter so as to ascertain how far the attitude of both sides was justifiable and to analyse aU likely causes of the gen- ~ral uneasiness, so that we might then he lU a position to consider possible solutions by which the Security CounCiI would justify tbe .confidence the world has placed in it and which would, at the sarne time, meet ils primary obligation under the Charter to safeguard interna1tional peace and security. ,1 also take this opportunity to expres'i my conviction that the four Powers who heur the responsibility for the administration of Berl.in and upon whose shoulders also weighs the obligation to preserve the peace, will want to contribute in aIl sincerity ta the success of the efforts undertak.en by the six other members of the Secul'lty Couneil. These States have no other intention or uim than thaï of acting with the greatest impal'tiality, the fuIlest indepoendence and with the strictest eauity, until a solution can be found to thê 'pl'oblems und€r discussion and tranquillity has been restored tothe peace-Ioving peopl,es of the world. lVIr. EL-KHOURI (Syria): Having parti·, cipat€d during the last ej'Jht days in ;he consultations which have taken place hetween five non-'permanent members of the Security Council together with China, on the probl.em which isbefor€ the SeLurity Council-th€ dispute on Berlin-I am gIad to he able to assocÏl:te myself €ntirely with the statement made by the relp·resentativ,e of Canada, in which he expresS€d our sincere appreciation for the able and wis'e manner in which our President, lVIr. Bramuglia, has co?ducted t~ose consu~t~tions \Vith the intentIon of findmg a conclhatory approach betwe€n the cont:roversial views and attitudes of the parties so as to find a way to compromise and conci:liate these different views. As the President stated at the beginning of this m€eting, the whoIe world 1S awaiting an affirmation and assurance from ,the Security Council and the United Nations that ther·e is no threat to the peace, that there is no danger that a new war will break out in -the world. The world is fright€ued by ,the spectre of war, following the two successive eXlp,eriences it has had in the space of a quarter of acentury. And how can we assure the world now that peace will prevail and that no dang,er of war really exists? I:t is not by moral speeches, advice, and condemning war that this assurauoo wiH be secured. \Vho will believe such words and such verbal assuranoes when the world now witnesses three great Powers-permanentmembers of the Ser.'urity Council-submitting a complaint ta the Council confirming that a We-the group of six memhers of the SecurHy Council who have held these consultations in an informaI manner in the pasl eight days-have tried ta find sorne way to attain such a rapprochement, such a conciliatory rapprochement, between these two theses ; but 1 must say thal, so Ïar, wc have not obtained what we' wanted, but we are still hopeful, and the President of the Security Council, who has heen conducting these consultations, 1 believe is still hoping lO succeed. Statesmen like hi111 never despair and are never pessimistic. They alv:ays entertain the hope of success. 'Ve aIl believe and hope that sound judgment hetween the gl'eat Powers will prevail in the end, and that they will come ta!he Security Council and tell us, .. 'Ve have arranged this business among ourselves. vVe have con- , Jeted a great war and we have won it ; we should win the 'peace also." It should Ilot he hard for them to make com~promises and concessions so as to a'ppease the anxiety of the world which is now very widespread; this anxiety may impede business, commerce, industry, and an other activities, social as weIl as politicaI, Ihroughout the world. règnent 1 do ·not believe that there are shouIders in the world strong enough to bear such a heavy responsibility, and Nè hope that good judgment will prevail among them so as :to reassure us and the world that the gl'eat Powers are in fad ready to make concessions and approach each other direct- Iy. Thus the wOl'ld would be grateful to the great Powers not only beCJause' they reHeved the world from fascism but because they aIso l'elieved the wOl'Id from lhis present state of fear.

1 snould like to iexpr,ess my sincere gratitude for the statementsInade by the reprel'emercie Canada, These questions are, in our OpInIOn, of great importance in helping us to form an opinion. They are as foIlows : First of aIl we request the representatives of the United States of America, the United Kingdom, France and the Union of Soviet Socialist Republics to explain in detail the circumstances in which the restrictions on communications, transport and commerce between Berlin and the Western Zones of Germany and between the latter and the Soviet Zone were originaHy imposed, together with details of the enforcement of the restrictions and the present state of affairs. This question has. thereforc, Huee aspects: (1) the circmTIstances connected with the initial imposition of restrictions; (2) de:tails of theirenfol'cement; (3) the present state of affairs. The second question is as follows : we request the representatives of the United States of America, the United Kingdom. France and the Union of Soviet Socialist Republics to explain in detail the agreement involved in the instructions given :to the military governors of the four Powers in Berlin, and to give the precise reasons which ni'evented its implementation. We undel"s:tand that the representatives of these four Powers may perhaps not be in a position to supply at once the detailed information 1"equested. If that is so, 1 am sure that :the Security Council will have no objection to waiting tmtil the next meeting to hear such information. If, on the contrary, they are ready to reply now, 1 should l caU upon the representatives of the countries to whom l have just referred. Ml'. JESSUP (United States of America) : 1 can sayat once that the United States Gov:ernment is very glad to express ifs full willingness to comply with the request of the President in regard to the questions he has just put before us, and, in so doing, to co-operate, as the l'epresentative of Colombia has suggested, in the work which the six members of the Securi:ty Council have been carryir..g on 50 conscientiously under the leadership of the President in their search for further information and clarification. In the statelllellt which l lllud,e to the Security Council on 6 October [3631'11 meeting], l lllentioned that we were quite ready to supply allY additional information which the Council might desire. Of course, we are stiU ready to do sa. The President has suggested that the questions which have been put before us are designed ta secure full information on the points 10 which they refer. l should not care ta attempt to give aIl those details offhand supplementing those already supplied bath in the annexes to the original reference to the Security Council, and in the oral statements which have been made in the Council by the Government representatives of France, the United Kingdom and the United States of America. At this time th-erefore l should merely like to say a word or two in answer to .these questions. The first one sooms ta call for a fuller description of the blockade measures which were imposed by the USSR, and ·which constitute a threa:t to the peace, which was refoel'red to the Security Council in the notificatIon of 29 September. The second question, as J understand i:t, seerns to refer to a point which J made in my previous statement on 4 October [361st meeting] , where l dealt with the steps which have been taken hy the three Governments in accordanœ with their obligations under Article 33 of the Charter. First of aIL that obligation was ta find a means of settling difficulties -hy dire-ct discussions. Of course, it was not the failure of the discussions which crea:t,ed the threat ta the peace; it was, in faet, the threat to the peace whh:h led ta the discussions, and then to the reference of this matter to the Security COl1nciL Howev-er, the President has indicated that he wishes to have full information on these points, and in accordance With that suggestion, my delegation wHl he quite pre- .pared to supply that information at the next meeting of the Council. 1 should like ta take this op'Portunity of saying one word of appredation of the conseientiousness with which those members. of the Council are addressing thell1- selves ta the task, and in particular of the courtesy which 1 have experienced at the President's hands. The suggestion has been made by the President that it might be weIl not ta attempt ta reply ta these questions at this sitting of 'the Couneil. 1 think that the documents already submitted to the Council, and the statements which have been made. have already cov·ered some of the ground. The members of the Couneil woulel not, 1 think. wish to caver that same ground again ; therefore. any statement in reply to these questions would require careful drafting. 1 would also refer to the faet that my Government has issued, in the last few days. quite a comprehensive 'Vhite PUlper. 1 have been able to obtain a number of copies for circulation to the members of the Council, and 1 think they will find that that also provides a .good deal of information in reply to these questions. Therefore,I will refrain from attempting ta give replies now. but 1 assure you that 1 will reply to them as rapidly as possible. 1 dlo not think there need be any fear that th,ere will be any delay in the matter. My delegation is Iprepared. within a short space of. time. ta give you aIl the supplementary information which the six members of the Security Council need. Ml'. PARÙDI (France) (tralls/ated (rom French) : When my Government dedded, together with the Governments of the United States and the United Kingdom, to lay before the Se-curity Council the maUer ,v.hich is now before it, wc were fully conscious of :the seriousness of the step we took and fully eonscious that wc weJle submitting to the United Nations Organization the most delieate question that it has had to deal with so far. We had, in particular, thoroughly estimated the weight of responsibility that we thus laid upon the six members of the Security Couneil who are not directly concerned in the matter and who eonsequently had Ilot from the heginning ,taken up a definite stand with regard to it.. . . ~ 1 would like ta say that l fully appreciate the ,evidence which has been given today of the conscientious ·manner in whieh the 1 indicated fm'ther that we ·entertained the stea-dfast hope that the Security Council would, thanks to ils authority, succeed where direct conversations had failed. That was tantamount to saying that we \Vere wholly l'eady to accede to any request that might be made for supplementary information. And since you now ask HS for details on two very definite points, il goes without saying ihat my delegation will give the answers that you require as clearly and as fully as possible. Nevertheless, 1 consider, as do the representatives of the United States and the United Kingdom, :that il is difficult immediately La give an answer to questions which are so technical and which reqllire detailed and precise replies. 1 therefore j oin with them in asking ,permission to avail myself of the opening which you yourself gave when you indicated that undoubtedly, in view of the nature of the questions, it would not be possible for us to answer them here and . now. 1 shaH therefore reply at a subsequent meeting of the Security COUDcil. .socialistes lVIr. VYSHINSKY (Union of Soviet Socialist Republics) (translated from Russian) : The , President has proposed to the representaUves of the four Powers-the United States of America, the United Kingdom, France and the Soviet Union-that they should reply to :two questions asked by him, giving ashis motive the need to obtain additional information so as to fully 'Clarify the natur,e of the question with which we are concerned. The USSR delegatioll must als0 comply \Vith the President's request and r...call first of a; the reoent statement made by the repre::.entative of :the USSR in the Security COUDcil, in which he announced that the USSR delegation found it impossible to take any part in the discussion of the Berlin question in :the Security Council [361st meeting]. The USSR delegaLion had given a detailed exposition in three inte~V1entions \Ve have shown and proved that the Berlin question is not a ma:îter for the Security Council, tha! the question can and must be settled and l'Csolved by different and legal methods, with the help of those bodies and methods which were set up by special agreement among the four Powers to consider and settle uny questions which might come under the general heading of the "German question", including, of course, the question of the situa:tion in Berlin. vVe have shown that the whole Berlin question arose as a result of violations of and ·deviations from agreed decisions on the part of the tIu'ee Western Governments which concerned on the one hand, the agreed decision to introduce the German mark of the Soviet Zone in Berlin as the sole 'currency and, simultaneously, on the other hand, to countel~mand restrictive measures in accordance with provisions of the directives of 30 August which 1 have mentioned. In the circumstances-we affirmed this at the time and 1 would take the liberty of mentioning it again now-if this matter is approached in a serious fashion and not for purposes entirely unconnected with a real desire to l'leach a settlement, then the Security Council cannot he in any way 'concerned with il. This is why the USSR delegation had proposed at tha:! time that the Berlin question should not be included in the agenda aJ.id,~'ouM not be submitted to the Securitv Council. From the very beginning the Government of the USSR pointed to other ways -1 must again 1"ecall this fact-but the majority of the Councildid not agree with them. The USSR delegation still holds the 1 would recall that the Berlin question was submitted tothe Security Council on the initiative of the three Governments who illsisted on having the question considered bv the Couneil. Il is only llatural that, as nie)' insist that the matler beexamilled bv the Council, these Governments are very ,~illing to ,provide additional information in reply to the two questions which the President of the Coullcil has asked us today. But, Ml'. President, does it not look as though these questions we11e being asked here for the sole purpose of involving the USSR delegation in discussion of the Berlin question, despite the decision taken by the USSR delegation, of which it informed the Security Council ? It would seem to be a very convenient method, first to put questions, then ta attempt to obtain replies, then to embark on a discussion of these replies, and thus, to place the USSR delegation in a 'position in which it must needs take part in the discussion of these questions in the Security Coundl. This method is mûst skilful and original, but also v,ery naive ; it is futile to imagine that the USSR delegatioD will fall for such a bait, or stick to the glue which has been s:meared over the paper inscribed with the words "Berlin question ". No, gentlemen. Fkst of aIl the large number of documents which have heen published throughout the whole world' make this quite clear. These documents must be studied and the necessary ,conclusions drawn. It would, however, he vain and fallacious to hupe that the USSR delegation will submit any mate l or explanations to the Security Council, since the de1egation of the USSR neither can nor will taIre part inlhe discussion of the Berlin question in the Security Couneil. The question has been submitted to the Council in an arbitrary way, in contrav.ention of the agreements in force and of Article 107 of the United Nations Charter. We therefore see no ground for departing in any way from our IposHion. The deloegation of the Union of Soviet Socialist Republic<.:, accordingly, deems it i;rnpossible ta submit any materia1. whatsoever to the Secl1rity Councl1 a'ud conse- . Ml'. EL·KHOURI {Syda) : 1 have listened carefully to the statement made today by th€ l'epresentative of the Union of Soviet Socialist Republics, and 1 find that il is not different from the previous statement which he made at our last meeting and to which he thought 1 was not listening. 1 should like to ask the representativ€ of the USSR a question concerning procedure from the juridical point of view. This item !tas been included in the agenda of th€ Security Council. vVhen a question concerning international peace and security i'ssubmitted to the Security Conneil by three great Powers-which type of question il is theessential function of the Security Council to consider-it cannot be rejected befme discussing the reasons for which the Security Council may not be competent to deal with snch a question. Ml'. Vyshinsky states that th€ Security Couneil is not competent to discuss this matter. What wouJd Ml'. Vyshinsky now advise the Security Council to do ? The second of the two questions which wer€ introdnced by the President today refers to the previous formaI agreements which were concluded among the parties. Il deals with the question of whether there had been any such agreements and if so, why tlley were not implemented. This question may ref€!' to the same contentions raised by Ml'. Vyshinsky at our last meeting and again at today's meeting. Il refers to the agreements which he has mentioned, agreements which he states preclude the Security Council from dealing with the question. This matter should certainly be discussed by the members of the Security Council, in order to formulate an opinion of th€ competence of the Council. When these agl~ee­ ments are tpresented and àiscussed, we shall he able -to determine which disputes should be solved according to their provisions. \Ve may find that the non-implementation of those agreements is due to one party or the oiher ; and we may refer to -certain Articles of the Charter to assist us in solving the matter. We have not decided anything yet. We have not yet arrived at any conclusion concerning th€ competence of the Council in this maUer. In this matter, there is no intention of setting a trap in order to induce the :vepresentative of the Union of Soviet Socialist Republics to enter into the discussion. 1 Article 36, paragraph 2, of the Charter stnles : .. The Security Council should take illto consideration any procedures fGr the settlement of the dispute which ha,,~e already heen adopted by the parties. " The second question 'put by the President, :ref,ers to sucll a matter. Il has been stated Ihat, on 30 August, an agreement had been rea'ched for the solution of ·the dispute with particular reference to the removal of the l'estrictions and to the currency question. A point which should be clarified is why Ihis agreement was not im.I?lementerl. The Security Council should be enlightened as 10 the steps taken in that l'espect. 'Vithout discussing these points we cannot come ta a final solution regarding the question of competence raised by Ml'. Vyshinsky.

1 must indeed conf,ess that l have heard \Vith sorne surprise and with the greatest regret the terms used by the representative of the Union of Soviet Socialist Republics in framing the arguments which, he considers, justify his case. In point of fact, no intention to "trap" anyone can be attributed to the six counlries which have tried to investigate questions which have been raised before the Security Couneil. Such an intention is far from our minds and no snch assertion should be made in the SecuJ'ity Council or in any other body of the United Nations as no such motive can exist in the spirit of the nations which form the United Nations. . ,I should like to point out that the queshons put forwar'Ù and which were intended as a means of obtaining full information forcountries not involved in the Berlin question-countries which are absolutely lleutral and have no material interest in :Ihe matter, only a spiritual interest, that of findillg a basis for 'constructive world peace-could have been answered by the Union of Soviet Socialist Be1pnblics not v,erbally, but in writing. A reply given in this way could not he interpreted as participation in the discussion. . Thus it would not have been in any way lllconsistent with the criteria formulated in the Security Council and would definitely not have implied an active participation in Ihe discussion, as l have already pointed out. concrete~ clear and precise aims the realization of which are· to enable men to live together as a community. Confronted with aconflict of such a nature, confronted with the possibility of conflicts of a magnitrie and nature realized by everyone in the world, how could the Security Council remain impassive and confine itself to mere questions of a legal order or questions of competence? Is not every member of the Secul'ity Council inspired by an innate desil'e to co-ordinate human efforts for the establishment and maintenanoe of peace ? This question must be asked, and 1 am sure that the re,presentative of the USSR shares with aH of us our hope for a lasting peace. 1 am absolutely convil1'ced of tha1. 1 can accept the faet tha:t the representative of the Union of Soviet Socialist Republics does not submit the required information; 1 can accept that he maintains his position or theory, and the line he has to take according to the instructions he has received from his Government. AH that is permissible. What is not possible, however, in my opinion, is his interpretatiol1 of our attitude. We have adopted the attitude which our conscience requir.ed us to adopt. 'Ve have put to the representatives of the countries involved the questions which our consci·ence required us to ask.. Therefore, 1 firml;y and categorically deny that any intention of deceptionexisted in our minds. None of us had any intention of setting a trap. 'v'e put these questions in an good fa1th. EViery country must know, in keeping with its standards and princiJples, what attitude it has to adopt, but snch a subjective judgment of our thoughts appea:rs to me to he' a most incorrect procedure. 1 say this again with deep regret as we are aH entitled to respect, and this fact should he horne in mind in Security Council dehates. We shaH thus s,et an example of :mutua! respect to the world and show that the United Nations is an Organization tr'uly se:t U!p' to pacify minds and consciences and to enahle, so far as possihle\ men to live together on this planet, whatever may ·he ,their ways of life, for no humanheings can live in the stratosphere. .Ml'. VYSHINSKY (Union of Soviet Socialist Republics) (tmnsla'ted {l'Dm Ru:ssian): 1 should Iike to dwell very briefly on Ml'. Bramuglia's last remarks. 1 have not the least intention of justifying myselfbecause of what 1 have said. 1 stated quite clearly:that to put such questions to the USSR delegation, which is taking no part in the discus- . sion of :the question, might provide a pretext for attempts to involv·e it in a discussion, which would be contrary to our .position in the matter. 1 made no alle-gations whatsoever as to the motives of individual representatives or delegations, and fail to understand the cause of the recriminations made llV :Mr. Bramuglia. ~

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